The following is a Q & A that I found on the internet. I found it very interesting and something that should seriously be considered. I hope you enjoy it as much as I did.
Question:
I figure this question will open a new can of worms, but hey, what's new with this group?
This is why I enjoy this group so much!
We are studying "Identifying Marks Of The NT Church" in our Bible class in the congregation I am a part of. In our study, we have obviously come to discuss the office of elders. The sudies are quite typical from a church of Christ perspective with all the usual comments / debate. As of the past few months, I have thought about this subject (and especially now since it so fresh) and want to get the thoughts of the gang. The question I have asked many of late is "How do 'we' appoint elders today?" The answers are usually the same (i.e. nominate individuals, give time for congregation to vet/question/grill these men and then have a 'vote' on them. Any church I have been a part of (my ripe old age is 42) has been the same. The only problem is that as 'we' (in churches of Christ) hammer "pattern, pattern, pattern" I keep asking the question "Where is the pattern that I just described found in the Bible? Can anyone share some thoughts. The "pattern" I see is the apostles or Timothy or Titus appointing men to serve in this capacity. I post first century, am I drenched in stupidity to think that this office was useful and necessary for a certain time(before all fulfilled) and after it is like many other things that have passed? Since the Chief Shepherd has come, isn't He enough Shepherd for us? Hope I don't not appear sarcastic or anything other than sincere, but just want some input from you, my brothers and sisters who I have come to appreciate more than I can ever tell you (even though I have met a very very few).
Thanks in advance - look forward to your thoughts!
John Smith
Hi John,
So much of what we "pattern" ourselves after is a church which was established in the Last Days of the Old Covenant and in which were the gifts of the Holy Spirit. Gifts, which we are told, were "in part," and only until a time of the Perfect, or a full grown man.
During these Last Days of the Old Covenant age, certain things were given to the church. Two of these we have acknowledged, but three of these we never mention. I speak of Eph 4:11-13, " Eph 4:11 And he gave some to be apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers;
Eph 4:12 for the perfecting of the saints, unto the work of ministering,
unto the building up of the body of Christ:
Eph 4:13 till we all attain unto the unity of the faith, and of the
knowledge of the Son of God, unto a fullgrown man, unto the measure of the
stature of the fulness of Christ:
We understand that apostles and prophets have been removed from the list, but could it also be that evangelists, pastors and teachers, have also been removed?
When we include 1Cor 12:28ff into our thoughts, we note that there are a number of other functions of the body that are given and they all refer to duties in the body of Christ requiring spiritual gifts. In this list we have: "first apostles, secondly prophets, thirdly teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, divers kinds of tongues."
These also are gifts to the body of Christ which are "in part." Pastors is a term not listed in this one, but you do notice the word, governments, which is also given as "administrations," in some versions. In the age to come, of which we are, these types of gifts were to be absent from the church.
In Mt 20:25-27, Jesus said, "But Jesus called them to Himself and said, "You know that the rulers of the Gentiles lord it over them, and their great men exercise authority over them. It is not this way among you, but whoever wishes to become great among you shall be your servant, and whoever wishes to be first among you shall be your slave."
Our thought has long been to pattern ourselves after the 1st Century church. We found that elders were selected by apostles as they returned to the churches that were begun by them. (Acts 14:23). We saw Timothy and Titus, as evangelists, appointing elders (1Tim 3; Titus 1). In every case, spirit-gifted men appointed elders.
Now that we find ourselves in a nonspirit-gifted age, how are elders appointed? Are we even to have elders? We noted above that apostles and prophets are no longer with us. Could the same be true of evangelist, pastors (elders) and teachers? Should we appoint someone to exercise authority over us? Or if someone wishes to be great among us, should he not be our servant?
The ones who lead us are the ones who are ministering and laboring in our midst. Do they really need to be "appointed" to the task? Do we need to be administered to when administrations were part of that which was to cease?
Churches today usually grow around the one who ministers the word. The men and women of the congregation take upon themselves the tasks to meet the spiritual and physical needs of the body. Are appointments made? Surely! Perhaps there is a need to feed the widows as in Acts 6. Without apostles to make the appointments, how shall it be accomplished? Would not the
congregation make the appointments to accomplish the task? Apostles are in the original picture, but were they to continue there?
What shall the church call their older men? Are they necessarily appointed as "older men?" Are men and women necessarily appointed as deacons(servants)? Could they be? Will not congregations necessarily be different from each other as they minister to each other?
So, what is the pattern that we seek? Is it not the one the Lord gave in Mt 20? "Whoever wishes to become great among you shall be your servant, and whoever wishes to be first among you shall be your slave."
My thoughts,
Jim Hopkins
One of the original signers of the "9.5 Theses for the Next Reformation."
